Choosing Raw Interview: Jared Koch of Clean Plates NYC

New York. The Big Apple. The Empire City. The Capital of the World. The City so Nice, They Named it Twice. Among its many fine attributes—and they are very, very many—New York is a city of fine dining. Few cities can boast of a restaurant culture so rich, so varied, so adored by its patrons. From the pre-fixe at Per Se to arguments about the best pizza or schwarma, New Yorkers love eating out.

I’m a quintessential New Yorker in many (OK, most) ways, but this is one part of New York culture that I don’t quite participate in. As I mentioned in my interview with Sarma Melngailis, I’m not one for restaurant food. Typically, restaurants don’t make the kind of food I love to eat, and if they do, they make it in tiny portions (my perpetual “handful of mesclun greens” salad gripe). And as someone who loves to cook—who finds some major stress relief in the kitchen—dining out tends to feel more like deprivation than a special treat. I can certainly appreciate a nice meal out on a special occasion, but I’ve never quite understood how so many of my city brethren can eat out or get takeout once, twice, or even six times a week! In fact, I recall distinctly a fight I had with an ex—one of those little fights about a trivial habit which becomes a giant fight about lifestyle differences—wherein I expressed bewilderment at his takeout habit. (Let’s just say he was bewildered at my bewilderment.)

This said, I realize that I’m in the minority. Most New Yorkers (and most of my family and friends) get great pleasure from dining out. And they’re in luck, because New York’s restaurant culture is ever growing and accommodating new trends. Fortunately for us Big Apple dwellers, one of the best trends we’ve seen lately is the emergence of a vibrant culture of healthy, local, seasonal fine dining establishments. From the locavore feasts at Blue Hill and BLT Market to raw lasagna at Pure, from macrobiotics at Souen to seasonal menus at Park Avenue NYC, from vegan pizza at Café Viva to local cheeses at the farmer’s market, we New Yorkers have it good.

As a nutritional counselor, I couldn’t be more excited about this trend. What I notice often in my work that it’s very easy to help clients make changes within the home sphere, but very difficult to help them when they’re out in the world (or out at a restaurant). Most of my clients are happy to shop local and organic and cook healthy at home; most are willing to pack lunch in a week when they’ve got a whole lot of extra time in which to do it. But as soon as a healthy lifestyle entails some sort of sacrifice, be it cultural, social, or practical, they start to show resistance. And this point of resistance, as it were, often involves restaurant dining. This may mean discomfort with ordering a dish that sounds “weird” at a restaurant; it may mean indignation at passing up on the DB burger for a business lunch. In my experience, it’s very hard to change these reservations and discomforts. So oftentimes, the best thing one can do as a counselor is not to discourage restaurant dining, but rather to give clients practical tools for navigating restaurant culture in a healthy, yet enjoyable way.

Enter Clean Plates NYC. Forget Zagats, forget Time Out. In my mind, this is the ultimate New York restaurant guide. Co-authored by Jared Koch, a nutritionist, and Alex Van Buren, a food critic, it’s the best of both worlds: a resource both for foodies who won’t be content to subsist on steamed broccoli at the dinner table, and also for those of use who are discerning about the health properties of the food we eat. The guide features seventy-five New York restaurants, which range from elite dining to fast food, and reviews them with an eye on the quality of the food (organic, hormone-free), the culinary approach (local, seasonal), and the integrity of ingredients and cooking process. It also features interviews with seven eco-conscious NYC chefs (Sarma included!).

Unlike other restaurant guides, this one discusses whether a restaurant actually serves locally grown and organic produce, hormone and antibiotic free, sustainably raised animal foods, naturally sweetened desserts, and gluten-free, vegan, and raw options. But it doesn’t do this by advocating alfalfa sprouts and burdock root; instead, it discuss healthy dining by fine dining standards. It’s a healthy eating guide for those who are used to the pleasures of conventional restaurant cuisine.

Clean Plates is an invaluable resource for my local clients. It enables them to enjoy the pleasures of restaurant meals without jeopardizing their efforts to eat a whole foods, plant-centered diet. And it allows them to find restaurants that they can eat at with family members or friends who consider “health food” a dirty word. For me, Clean Plates has proven to be an important professional resource: I get stuck at a lot of business lunches, and I’ve already used the guide to come up with a few restaurants that are fun for me and won’t alienate an agent or author.

It should come as no surprise, then, that I’m extremely excited to welcome the author of Clean Plates, Jared Koch, to Choosing Raw for an interview. I originally contacted Jared to express admiration of his work (and to offer him help with any local outreach). When I proposed the idea of a blog interview, he responded with gracious enthusiasm.

A few weeks ago, Jared and I met for tea at Souen (a fave of his and mine both), and chatted about our work, our lifestyles, and our vision for the future. Jared began his work in health as a fellow nutritional counselor, but quickly found that the aforementioned “point of resistance” among clients was pushing him to take a different direction with his work. Jared still sees clients, but nowadays he devotes himself primarily to creating the kind of practical resources that will help his clients bring healthy habits out into what is still a pretty darn unhealthy world. Today, he’s planning on expanding on the work he started with Clean Plates NYC, and I’m sure he has many other tricks up his resourceful sleeve!

In my own work, I put a huge emphasis on the importance of sustainable, practical habits. Better to develop a few healthy eating skills that you can commit to than to take drastic measures that are likely to induce yo-yo patterns. In spite of having what seems like a radical nutritional perspective to many people, then, I share Jared’s passion for practicality. We also share a belief in bioindividuality (more on that below!) and a mutual passion for bringing healthier dining options not only to New Yorkers, but to Americans nationwide. It’s my honor to welcome Jared Koch as my Choosing Raw guest!

1) Obviously, the point of departure for this book was to give people a useful resource — a tool for making healthy choices within a busy, urban, and social lifestyle. Could you say a bit about the kind of tips that CLEAN PLATES NYC offers, in addition to the restaurant reviews themselves?

I think the main thing I was trying to do, in addition to the practical resource of the restaurants, is to set context for people.  To give them a simple, yet well thought out perspective on food and nutrition.  There is a lot of conflicting information out there and I am hoping to contribute to clearing up a lot of the confusion.  When all is said and done, it doesn’t have to be that complicated.

2) If you had to pick your most memorable dining experience — and I know that they’re all probably incomparable — which would you say has lived on in your memory, and why?

There was a lot of great meals but the one that stands out the most is Blue Hill.  It just feels like the ultimate pleasure.  The food is incredibly delicious, the service is attentive and informative, and you feel good about the food you are putting in your body.  No guilt and no sacrifice.  You walk away feeling satisfied and nourished on so many levels.

3) Part of what I love so much about your ethos as a health counselor is that you stress the notion of bioindividuality, and the futility of diet books or “shape up” plans. The importance of individualization is something I spend a lot of time stressing to my readers. Could you say a few words about bioindividuality and it’s basic premise? How much we each explore what makes us thrive, and what doesn’t?

Basically, bioindividuality means there is no one “right way” to eat for every human being.  It really depends on our individual internal (genetics etc.) and external factors (season, temperature etc.)

I think the second question brings up a great point about our motivation to eat healthier and take care of ourselves.  My personal experience and my experience with my clients has taught me that unless one is deeply connected to the “WHY” then they usually don’t sustain their good habits.  I always try to get people to explore the deeper motives and the ability to thrive is one of them.  I believe if we are living to our fullest and deepest and highest potential then we are ultimately serving and giving back.  Having our physical body and mind functioning optimally is ultimately a means to an end.  Which leads me back to bioindividuality and why I like it so much.  It takes away a lot of the dogma and gets to the heart of the matter which is…what is the best way to eat to best serve my body?  I think it liberates us to have a perspective that is more open minded and truly paying attention to reality, rather than trying to force a particular theory upon ourselves and others.

4) What sort of diet seems to have worked for you, and why? Please be honest, here: my lovely readers hail from all lifestyles, and non-vegan, non-raw (or semi-raw) perspective is a welcome part of the Choosing Raw dialogue. We love to hear about all sorts of perspectives.

I think it is great that your community is so varied.  One of the points I often stress when I am speaking at events is that our dietary choices should not be divisive.  There is too much in this world that is divisive and the last thing we need is for people who are attempting to be more conscious and make better choices for themselves and our collective well being to be divided, too.

On a personal level, I have experimented with a variety of diets over time.  Raw, vegan, vegetarian and of course I started out with a typical American diet.  Over time, I have come to incorporate a little bit from a lot of different theories.  Being 100% vegan, or raw, or even vegetarian never worked well for me.  I always felt weak and would lose a lot of weight.  I never felt like I had my optimal mental clarity.  When I started eating more sustainably raised (grass-fed, pasture raised) meats into my diet I felt a lot better.  I presently eat almost no processed foods, refined sugar, alcohol or caffeine and eat mostly a mix of raw and cooked veggies and fruit, nuts and seeds, some whole grains and some sustainably raised meats and only on occasion dairy.  Some days I am vegan and some days I am not.

5) Part of what I loved about meeting you was your sense of optimism that the mainstream attitude towards nutrition in this country is moving forward, and your determination to be an agent of change in that process. What are some concrete improvements in food production and healthy living that you envision–or at least hope for–within a decade? What sort of role would you like to play in the process?

I think the reality is that there are a lot of opposing forces at work.   While I don’t ignore or deny the negative, I personally choose to focus on the positive and looking for solutions.  I think there are so many changes happening that are making people realize it is important to be conscious about the foods you choose to consume.  I also think there are a lot of systemic change that needs to occur on so many levels and we are just beginning to understand the issues.  My main area of focus at this point is contributing to helping more and more people make personal change by providing perspective, education and ultimately the practical resources of the restaurants so eating healthier and more sustainably is easier and enjoyable.  I do think this will have a ripple effect that will contribute to more systemic change; as if we’re a company with the capacities to reach a lot of people.  Which I plan on doing.

I am also interested in seeing that good quality food is readily available and affordable for everyone. And I would love to see it more prevalent in schools and hospitals.  I would love it if in ten years sustainable farming practices were much more the norm than the exception.

Thanks, Jared!

Fortunately for my New York readers–and those readers who’d like a copy for future visits–Jared has been kind enough to offer you a chance to win Clean Plates. Simply leave a comment on this post with your favorite healthy (or semi-healthy) local dining spot. I’ll announce the winner two weeks from today! And if you have other comments to share, just mention that you’re not submitting for the giveaway.

As mentioned in my last post, I was supposed to be off to Saratoga this afternoon for the Vegetarian Expo. On route, I was supposed to be stopping at the Woodstock Farm Sanctuary to pat the piglets, and to have a vegan dinner. Well, guess what? I’ve been felled by my first seasonal cold in three years, and I feel, quite frankly, like crap. I’m extremely annoyed by this: I’m always so delighted to tell people (and it’s true) that I rarely, if ever get colds since I switched to a vegan diet. And to have my first in a while coincide with such a fun weekend away really bums me out. This said, traveling and working a full day tomorrow might be the difference between a 24 hour cold and a longer one, so I’ve sadly decided to stay home. My friend Cassie will be taking photos of the event for me–she’ll be manning the Farm Sanctuary booth! So we’ll all get to live vicariously through her. Happy Friday, all.

xo

P.S. Speaking of interviews, guys, check out this great interview with Sarma!