Happy Monday, CR readers!
This morning, as I was on the train to work, friend and reader Grace emailed me to ask whether or not I’d heard Angelina Jolie’s recent statements about her failed experience as a vegan. I hadn’t; by the end of my train ride, though, I’d caught up.
Edited to add: I found out about five minutes ago from a friend who works at a news publication that this statement from Jolie hasn’t actually been confirmed. So let’s assume I’m most interested in Mercola’s response, and the issues underlying this topic–whether Jolie actually uttered these exact words isn’t as important.
Ms. Jolie was quoted as saying that veganism “nearly killed her” by failing to give her adequate nutrition. Soon after, Joseph Mercola—a notorious health alarmist and product peddler who is quick to expound upon anti-vegetarian sentiments—launched into one of his customarily roving monologues in response. You can find his thoughts on the topic here.
Mercola’s sentiments are not without validity, of course. It’s other posts of his, always hysterical in tone, that have earned my disdain (I also make it a rule never to trust anyone who has a pop up window on his or her site trying to sell me something useless). I agree with him wholeheartedly that human beings have different constitutions and nutritional needs; this is why I never get into prescriptive dialogs about calories, vitamins, protein, or the like on this blog. I’d also agree that there may be a portion of the human species that has above average needs for animal protein. I’ve spoken to MDs who support vegan diets for most people, but note that there are some people who have an unusually hard time assimilating complete proteins from plant based sources. (Naturally, this doesn’t take into account other reasons why veganism may be a challenge: lifestyle, culture, tastes, psychology, etc.)
But it’s also important to note that, from a scientific standpoint, a careful, informed, and balanced vegan diet can provide for all essential human nutrients, with the exception of B-12 and D3 (which are easily had via supplementation). The lived experience of veganism may take some getting used to, some trial and error, but the diet itself is a perfectly healthy option for most people. Some (myself included) might say that it is a superior option for many people!
I also have to chuckle at the glee and zeal with which Mercola (and some others who have tried veganism and given it up) love to speak out against the lifestyle—as if, since it didn’t work out for them, they must tear it down for others. Vegan diets may not work for all people, but it’s usually hard to know why. Take Angelina: who knows what her actual diet consisted of? She’s rumored to be a restrictive eater (certainly past photos indicate as much), so is it possible that she simply wasn’t eating enough, or with enough variety? The sufficiency and adequacy of any way of eating is contingent, at least in part, on the responsibility and motives of the eater in question, and we don’t know what Angelina’s state of mind or daily habits were.
The vast majority of women I’ve worked with who had a bad experience with veganism in the past simply were not eating enough variety and caloric density to supply their bodies’ needs; they also frequently paired veganism with other drastic and overnight dietary changes (giving up certain food allergens, or going 100% raw). The overall effect was a devastatingly restrictive pattern of eating. I have absolute respect for anyone who has followed a well balanced vegan diet and found it wanting, but I know from experience that many people who try veganism and fail to thrive simply haven’t bothered to modify the lifestyle to suit their own needs. Any new way of eating involves guesswork, patience, and trial and error: you figure out what’s working and what isn’t, and you modify it until you feel great.
This is actually why I so admire my buddy Brendan: many of you may be surprised to hear that Brendan’s first run with veganism was a big flop! He was tired, sluggish, and hungry all the time. Rather than decide right away that veganism itself was to blame, Brendan studied nutrition carefully and identified precisely what was lacking in his diet. In his case the culprits were, among a few other things, iron and Omega-3 fatty acids. As soon as he took care to find vegan sources of these nutrients, he found his own best health, and the rest is history.
The point? Holding up one vegan who failed to thrive as proof that veganism is nutritionally inadequate is just as silly as pointing to an obese person with heart disease or diabetes and saying that he or she is proof that all omnivorous diets are excessive. There are healthy omnivorous diets, and healthy vegan diets. One can be either restrictive or overly indulgent with all sorts of foods. Perhaps omnivorous diets have a greater built in risk of excess and Western disease than plant based diets, and perhaps plant based diets carry a greater risk of nutritional inadequacy. But both ways of living can provide most people with all that they need (and not too much).
If you’re not bored of the topic yet, Christina Pirello posted a nice response here. And doctor Stuart Seale posted a interesting rejoinder here. I encourage you all to check them out!
And that’s quite enough food and debate for this Monday! I’ll be back tomorrow with a fun cooking tutorial.
xo
I'm a Certified Clinical Nutritionist, a former book editor, and a post-baccalaureate pre-med student at Georgetown University. I'm passionate about helping people to discover and enjoy plant based foods in a simple and healthy way. My name is pronounced like "Jenna." 
{ 99 comments… read them below or add one }
Hi Gena
I keep hearing that the only way to get B12 is through supplements…but what about nutritional yeast and coconut milk yogurt? I guess I’m not sure why no one seems to mention those things. Please let me know – thanks!!
Bree
Bree,
Hi! B12 is actually a tricky one. Last week, I tweeted out that I find the variances in retention of this vitamin remarkable. I was a vegan four for years with ZERO supplementation (naughty, naughty Gena), and when I finally did get checked, my B12 levels were totally average. So clearly, I hang onto it really well. I also know omnivores who are always low on it, or vegans who immediately need to supplement.
So for someone like me, nutritional yeast and fortified foods would likely be fine. For others, supplements are necessary longterm.
G
I’m not vegan, or even vegetarian, but I still need to take B-complex supplements every day because my B12 levels are low no matter what I eat!
I believe the B12 in nutritional yeast is actually a fortification – it’s not natural! I don’t know anything about the coconut milk yogurt, though.
Well said as always Gena! I love how eloquently you make your points. I wish I could provide responses the way you can.
Wow – she thinks she almost got killed by veganism!? That’s ridiculous! It makes me angry that someone would speak out so negativly against it. I believe a vegan diet is healthier than a regular one, and since becoming vegan, I’ve felt 10 x better! |I reckon she probably wasn’t doing something right; soooo many times people have just assumed all I eat is leaves and fruit. Maybe that is what she did!? Gah.
If you had asked me this question a few months ago, I would have laughed and said ‘absolutely not, veganism is the best and healthiest diet for every single human being.’
Now I’m not so sure. I’m having health problems right now related to veganism. For the very first time in my entire life, I am unwell. I used to get a cold maybe at the most every 5 years or so. I’ve never once suffered from ill health even in the slightest, until now.
I’m working with an amazing team of doctors and nutritionists who are, thankfully, extremely supportive of the vegan lifestyle and diet. In fact, they ‘prescribe’ the diet frequently to remedy people’s health problems. But they all acknowledge that there are a few people who, no matter what, do not thrive as vegans. It is starting to appear that I might be one of those people. My body just cannot process/utilize the nutrients and vitamins from an entirely plant based diet.
Where I live we are required to get insanely thorough physicals every single year. I can actually flip back through the years and see 24 years of flawlessly perfect health and spot on numbers, then a bit less the next year, then a little bit less, not so good after that, and now finally, several years later, downright awful.
So far, I refuse to admit it. I am living in denial and I am getting sicker and sicker because of it. I’ve tried supplements, shots, prescriptions, everything under the sun. Luckily the doctors are all very patient with me and understand my reluctance to give up. But…I’m actually starting to wonder if veganism really is the best for every single person.
It is not in any way natural for the human body to get its vitamins/nutrients in synthetic supplement and pill form. Our bodies often can’t utilize them as well or as efficiently as when they come packaged in whole foods. So, should I spend the rest of my life getting regular shots, taking prescription dose supplements that make me feel like shit, and still not ever feeling ‘right’? I used to think veganism was so natural, and so perfect for everyone, but now I really don’t think so anymore.
So, now I’m at a horrible crossroad. Where do I go from here? Do I decide to feel exhausted, depressed, sleepless, always hungry and cold, for the rest of my life, (not to mention suffering from the side-effects of the medicine), or do I try to convince myself that maybe eating animal products is okay when it is the only way to feel healthy again? It is kind of ridiculous. All the useless medicine and supplements I’m taking now aren’t even vegan, so how is it any different than eating an egg occasionally? At least with the egg I wouldn’t feel wretchedly ill, and maybe it would even make me feel better. And then that sends me into a spiral of self-loathing, how could I even think such an awful thing!?!
Ughg. I’m about to cry just typing this. I haven’t even blogged about it yet because it just hurts way too much. I feel like a failure. I feel completely and totally heartbroken.
Tasha!
I’m going to email you personally to talk about all of this, but I did want to say publicly that, if you are someone whose body simply doesn’t “take” to veganism (and as I said in my post, I believe there is a portion of people who do not), you aren’t without options. Local, free range eggs may feel terrible to you, and I do sympathize (we are equally passionate about veganism, you and I!), but they can be a concession to the fact that you’re doing the best you can with the hand you’ve been dealt. I’m sure there are other foods you can think about, but I’d really have to know more about what’s going on from a health perspective.
My point is that you may need to find select animal products from sources you can live with; they may not be your “perfect world” scenario, but perhaps you can say to yourself, “this isn’t how I would like things to be, but given the reality of my health scenario, I’m making what I think is the least unfortunate choice.”
You can, of course, also go the course of continuing supplementation. I would support either decision. We’ll speak in person!
xo
Awww Gena, I’ve said it before and I’m sure I’ll say it again – you are the best.
The reason your blog has been at the absolute top of my list since I first discovered it is because you are not only so well spoken and thoughtful, but you are so compassionate, too. I knew that I could mention my health woes here and be listened to and supported. I’ve had some not so great interactions with other vegans who instantly started beating me down, saying that this had to be all my fault, what was I doing wrong, etc. It made me feel even worse.
I like how you mention ‘the least unfortunate choice’. As always, you are so right. I need to work out a balance between what fits with my ethics and my morals, and what is best for me. It has taken me a while, but I’ve started to realize that, you know what, I deserve to feel healthy!
I’m still hoping the answer is massive quantities of chocolate….
Hi Tasha,
Sorry to butt in. Hope you don’t mind…
I too have questioned at times whether veganism was the right for me because I felt sick. A doctor or two has even questioned it. But it seems like it’s sort of grasping at straws in a way. Well, you’ve done everything else, maybe it’s your diet. I am the first person to think that one deserves to feel healthy and experimentation with your diet might get you there. If you want to email with me I would be happy to be a sounding board as I’ve gone through lots of health stuff. Hugs,
Bitt
Tasha, as Bitt said below, I apologize for butting in.
I’m so sorry you are facing such a frustrating situation that is not only taking a physical toll on you, but an emotional one too. At the risk of not minding my own business, I wanted to point out that I always try to keep in mind what my big picture looks like, what the majority of my life represents. I am blessed that I have found relief from a chronic pain condition, however some of that relief comes in the form of a pill that I take three times a day that is not vegan. Sure, the actual foods that enter my mouth are always vegan, but one of the things that allows me to get out of bed every day, work and move is, unfortunately, not. Don’t get me wrong, I did loads of research, visited half a dozen doctors, and spent thousands of dollars trying different remedies. But when push comes to shove, this pill is a major component to the solution that ultimately worked for me (and if a vegan version comes out I’ll be the first in line!). I don’t think any of my vegan friends, Gena absolutely included, would sentence me to a painful, low-quality life.
The thing is, I do a lot for animals. I donate money (which I don’t have a lot of) to a few causes that are close to my heart, I volunteer at different events throughout the year, I raise awareness by answering questions about my diet to inquiring friends and family members and I blog about animal and ecological issues. I live as sustainably as I possibly can. Sure, maybe I can’t use the label “vegan”, but I think my actions speak louder than any label I could define myself with anyway.
Tasha, you are not summed up by a label. As a loyal reader of your blog I can assure you that you are much, much bigger than that. However, your vitality, whether it be found through continuing supplementation or through a small amount of animal products, is what allows you to campaign so effectively. Even if you ultimately decide to include animal products, you can still fight for the quality of life that these animals so deserve. You can still raise awareness about ecologically sustainable practices. When you look at your life as a whole, it will still represent the compassion you so deeply feel for the earth and the humans and animals that exist on it. As Gena has blogged about before, labels can be helpful sometimes, but they do not define us.
Again, sorry to be intrusive. I wish you all the wisdom and grace in the world as you figure out your next step
*Hugs*
Beautiful comment, and I couldn’t say it any better.
Tasha,
I went through a similiar thing over the last year. I was taking B-12 and following all nutritional reccomendations for vegans–varied diet including beans, nuts, lentils, whole grains, and of course fruits and vegetables. I literally felt like I couldn’t get out of bed and all my joints were swollen and sore and parts of me were tingling. I was having anxiety like never before. After trying many supplements, I ended up adding back in animal products. I don’t know why, but my body simply doesn’t seem able to get enough iron and b-12 from supplements and vegan diet. Took 6 months of eating some meat, eggs, etc…too feel better. I hate doing it and feel sad–but it scared me to see my health disintegrate and made me afraid what I was doing to my kids who I had been transitioning to vegan diet as well.
Kristin
Thank you for sharing this- it’s very brave! I wish you the best in figuring this out and recovering your health. To me, someone who eats vegan many days but keeps a little dairy and egg in now and then, I see veganism/vegetarianism as a spectrum of choices for balancing our health and the health of animals and the planet. I wonder if you could try very minimal dairy or egg products back in your diet, the most ethically sourced, and see how you respond. Personally I would still see such a person as a tremendous advocate and example of a plant based diet- a diet overwhelmingly composed of plant foods but not to the exclusion of ones health!
Thank you, Laura. I’m still trying to figure out what to do. It is so great to hear your point of view on this matter. I like how you referred to a spectrum. That’s a thought for me to ponder as I work through my options.
Holy sh*t. Tasha. I love you honey, and after I type my comment to Gena, I am emailing you too
xoxo
I too have, in the past, thought that only a vegan diet was the most healthy for everyone. In the last few years though I’m realizing that different things truly do work for different people.
Last winter my family had cold after flu after cold for months. I wondered how in the world this could be since we eat so well (vegan, whole grains, fresh veggies and fruit, very low sugar.) This year I have really taken a look and my family’s diet, have done a lot of reading on nutrition, and ran across the Traditional Foods way of eating. It promotes preparing foods in ways, that were traditionally done around the world long ago, that make the nutrients able to be assimilated better by the body. This includes soaking/sprouting/souring grains, beans, nuts and seeds, fermenting veggies, culturing dairy products, etc, etc. There’s a lot of meat stuff included but as a vegetarian (no longer vegan) I just over look that and focus on what I feel is best for my family.
Maybe something along these lines would be helpful to you? I only suggest it since you talked about the body getting and utilizing nutrients naturally from food. There is a huge overwhelming book on the subject with lots of recipes called Nourishing Traditions but I found a great blog with an e-course that makes it so easy to learn: http://gnowfglins.com/ I am so thankful I found that blog!
I finally feel like I found just the right thing for my family and hope it might help others as well.
Sara,
This is SUCH a sweet comment, and I really thank you for it. I love hearing about peoples’ evolving food journeys.
I have to admit that Sally Fallon and the Weston Price do not get much love here at Choosing Raw. I think the Weston Price foundation is preachy and fanatical, and I can’t spend more than a moment on their website without getting angry at the anti-vegan zealotry, complete with creepy photos of little kids shouting, “we’re happy because we eat MILK and BUTTER!” If people think vegans are strident, they need to hang out more with the raw milk underground. And I feel similarly about Fallon and her anti-soy crusade; a good friend interviewed her once, and said she was a true fanatic. In addition to all this, as I say below, I find arguments about the “ideal” human diet a bit misguided.
That said, I love SO MUCH about that book and what it offers! And I’m delighted to hear that it was the right path for your family. I, too, love sprouting, fermenting, and lacto-fermenting. I didn’t learn those things from NOURISHING TRADITIONS, but I did learn them from other raw foodies, and I am so glad I did!
I appreciate your input.
Gena
Lol there is definitely a bit of fanaticism flowing with both Fallon and Price. I have found that in almost any way of eating (or thinking) unfortunately. Balance is so important and its never the same for everyone!
So, here I am butting in as well!
I was exactly in your situation 1 year ago, and it was terrible. I was vegetarian for 5 years, vegan for 4 of them and watched my health decline and decline. I did everything right- veggies, lots of quinoa and beans, millet, brown rice, brown rice protein shakes, nut butters, avocado, some fruits, oats, flax, etc…I knew my stuff, I was an expert.
I was also so close minded and resistant to any other ways of living. This was “the only way.” However, due to my health getting so bad, I had to make a change. I was at a cross roads just like you are. After working with several doctors and nutritionists, one day, I had an egg…an OMG. The way I felt after that one egg= 100000000x better than I’d felt in years! It was seriously unbelievable. I went on just having eggs in my diet for 10 months, but I still felt I was lacking nutrients and still had symptoms, but seriously still much improved from how I was before. So after contemplating for umm, months (like prob at least
I decided to try fish. And again- OMG!!! After 1/2 a piece of wild halibut I had colour in my face for the first time in years, and, this is the big one- I WAS NOT COLD. I couldn’t believe it. I had been cold all the time since becoming vegetarian, and it was not due to an excessively low body weight/ED. I was always a thin/healthy weight.
So…I hope this can help you to see someone who struggled so much just like you, and someone who is now WAY better. I now have eggs 4-6 times a week, 2 brown rice protein shakes every day, fish 2 times a week and beans every day. I need protein and I could not get what I needed from a vegan diet. In essence- it WAS killing me. Everyone’s body is different, and I know we have our beliefs, but how healthy and strong can your mind be if your body is sick? Are bodies are the foundation. Please, try to find it in yourself to give your body what it needs. You will be ok, trust me. Better than ok.
Ha, and um, the sunglasses face is supposed to be 8. Not sure why that happened…
Wow, thank you so much for sharing your story Lauren. It helps to know that other people have been in the same situation as me, and that they did feel better and regain their health. I really, really don’t want to feel like this anymore. Thank you so much. Our bodies really are the foundation, I’m glad you pointed that out. I do need to take care of me.
Hello ladies!
I don’t at all mean to show a lack of respect, and I hope I don’t get pilloried on my own blog for saying this, but I just wanted to note that, from a nutritionist’s standpoint, the feelings of one’s cheeks immediately flushing after 1/2 piece of fish, or feeling “whole” after an egg (which you didn’t say, Lauren, but I have heard before) just aren’t really plausible. No matter how nutritionally deprived you are of a micronutrient, your body won’t immediately assimilate it and register the difference after eating it once (ie, it’s not like when you’re low on sugar or carbs, and you eat them and can immediately feel a positive change).
Lauren, I’m not at all denying that you felt better with the cumulative addition of fish and eggs! I’m sure you did. But often one hears reports of one single non-veg*n mean miraculously bestowing health improvement, and it’s simply not how things work.
Also, it’s important to look at what specifically was lacking and what was given. Perhaps, if you’re chronically low on a certain kind of protein, eggs provided it, but they can’t provide other things that vegans might be low on — for example, iron. So it’s important always to describe these improvements in specific terms, at least if we want the conversation to be about nutritional science.
Naturally, Lauren, you’re *also* talking about your whole health, which none of us can microanalyze here in the time we have. But as this is a nutrition blog, written by a nutritionist, I simply want to point out how the turnaround of deficiencies typically works
Gena
Hi Gena,
I totally understand you not *believing* that I could get colour in my face after eating 1/2 a piece of fish- I wouldn’t believe me either! It does seem kind of crazy and not really plausible. However, even though it may not make sense based on our *current* understanding of physiology, I have to say that we still have much to learn regarding the intricacies of the human body. We do not know everything- we know A LOT, but definitely not ALL. I can say this as someone who is currently in University in an Honours Science program and studying molecular biology, biochemistry, physiology, neuroscience, immunology etc. So I guess what I’m saying is that we don’t *truly* know, biochemically speaking, how my body reacted to the fish once it entered my body.
I also definitely agree with your comment regarding nutrient deficiencies. People need to eat foods which will provide them with the specific nutrient that THEIR body needs. Like you said, if I was low on iron, eggs would not have helped.
I have great respect for you Gena and what you write about. You empower women (and men!) to take charge of their own health. You are a passionate person and that’s one of the reasons I love your blog- because I am too.
Wow that was a surprisingly unthoughtful choice of words from someone who has seemed (in recent years, at least) more conscientious than that. I fear what kinds of negative lashing out against plant-based diets her celebrity influence will inspire…. ugh.
But your words speak so many truths. Thank YOU for being a thoughtful and intelligent voice in this debate!
I read this a few weeks and simply thought “Then you did it wrong.”
I take a b-12 supplement, once a week, because I use nutritional yeast VERY sparingly (candida issues.) I also take a calcium/magnesium/Vit D supplement daily. My doctor thinks I’m very healthy!
i don’t think angelina’s past indiscretions have anything to do with her credibility in the present moment, i think she is a beautiful human being…she has done A LOT of good. no one is perfect.
the vegan diet is not for everyone…and it’s been proven that some people with certain ailments must eat animal products. veganism works for some, but not for all.
i believe she said: “I joke that a big, juicy steak is my beauty secret. But seriously, I love red meat. I was a vegan for a long time, and it nearly killed me. I found I was not getting enough nutrition.” i don’t see her knocking the diet at all…she mentions it just didn’t work for her…i am also thinking that they probably have a private chef that cooks all of their meals…i know many people that have lost copious amounts of weight on the vegan diet…angelina was not always a sickly and skinny individual…
anyway…i just don’t think it’s right to put people down because they decide not to be vegan anymore…no one really knows what goes on behind the closed doors of another human’s life.
i hope i did not offend you with this gena…i am just letting you know my opinion.
I’m not offended, Nelly!
I’m actually not at all offended by her statement, per se (and as I just edited to add, it’s hard to know whether or not she did indeed say it). I’m interested mostly in the fact that certain people, some in the public eye, seem to relish any talk of veganism falling short of the dietary mark. It seems, to me, rather unfair, especially since it is so hard for us ever to know why veganism doesn’t work for someone, as outsiders. And I’m not saying that she DID try veganism and undereat–I’m only saying that it’s highly possible, and if so, is veganism the problem?
What you do remind me of is the fact that it’s not fair to read into a celebrity’s behavior, past or present, with a sense of certainty, so I have edited accordingly. Gracias, madam
G
Gena – do you have any recommendations for B / D vitamin supplements? Right now I’m using plain jane Trader Joe’s vitamins as my supplements. I’m also racking my brain on how great an impact algae (E3 Live, spirulina) make into the B12 recommended daily value…
sorry if this has been answered before. just hit me all of a sudden!
No recommendations, per se. I think a vegan supplement is a vegan supplement (I mean no gelatin, etc., in the capsules). I’m rather fond of MegaFoods and Vitamin Code, so you can check out their multis and Calcium+D3 (all vegan multis have more than enough B-12; unless you have a health complaint that necessitates it, you shouldn’t need a seperate B-spectrum pill.
If we all did what Angelina Jolie said, we’d have 6 children from across the globe per household. I’m glad she’s not such a swaying figure as Oprah for America’s sake.
Thank you for writing this and kudos for taking on the topic and the comments that ensue.
When one has health problems, there is a certain type of desperation than can happen. It doesn’t help when there are people telling you that veganism is to blame. Been there! It’s too bad some people use veganism as a disguise for an eating disorder or try to restrict too much. And people tend to pay way more attention to this stuff than the health stories of people healing from a vegan diet (is Bill Clinton’s foray into veganism getting as much press?).
Good to know about Brendan and glad he pursued. I agree with you about Mercola.
Thanks, B.
I agree with you that veganism is often a scapegoat when doctors have more mysterious problems to face. I know many people who had health concerns that their doctors just didn’t understand, and the doctors immediately blamed veganism, because the truth was that they didn’t know what all was going on. When those same people healed or improved (still on a vegan diet), it became clear that the problem hadn’t been veganism. In other words, diet is an easy thing to point fingers at when the problems we face are scary and unknowable, but it’s not always logical or fair.
G
“The vast majority of women I’ve worked with who had a bad experience with veganism in the past simply were not eating enough variety and caloric density to supply their bodies’ needs; “–
I would concur with that in large part!
However, just like Tasha wrote, there are women (people) who are extremely well read and well versed on all the nuances of veganism and take extreme care and diligence to eat a super well rounded awesome diet, and yet, they are having issues. Which leads one to ponder..maybe sometimes veganism may not be the right choice for them.
I know a few others in bloggieland who have un-veganized themselves for various reasons but I dont want to name drop b/c it’s not my place.
But it just goes back to we are all different. When I was pregnant, I ate salmon. I craved it. Now, no way. Our bodies are all different, and at diff times in our life cycles, we are even different. I am 99% vegan now. Trace dairy, but never outright cheese eating or anything but I am not gonna send back veggies that may have a smidge of butter on them. That’s my comfort zone.
For me, my body is happy and I feel strong and healthy this way. For others, they may not.
I think it’s interesting that Angelina is coming forward with all this after having twins and nursing them. I can say that after being pregnant and then nursing for 3 yrs (so 4 yrs almost of my life) one’s body is in NEED of major replenishing and re-fueling on a deep, deep level. I wonder if she did this. I wonder if she did the self-care she needed to, to replenish herself as a mother, and as a vegan. Who knows..
Sorry rambling…
This post is gonna generate one or two comments I think
Enjoy your inbox 
xoxo
Ha! Yes, I’m waiting for my hate mail.
I think anyone who reads this blog regularly knows that I’m no zealot. If my body failed to thrive, I’d be facing the same thorny issues Tasha is. I wouldn’t loathe myself no matter what I chose. I agree that some don’t thrive on veganism; I simply resent the implication that no one does.
Thanks for a great comment.
Assuming that Angelina did actually say Veganisim almost killed her – I am shocked… I have always been under the impression that most celebrities have their own personal nutritionist, so shouldn’t she say my nutritionist dropped the ball while I tried veganisim?
I agree with you Gena and everyone else’s comments here that Veganisim is not for everyone, however eating animal products is definately for everyone either… eating meat was the 1 reason I was sick and on my way to have my colon removed.
Gena – I am so glad you addressed this topic in your wonderful thoughtful eloquent manner. One of the things I have not discussed much on my blog at all is that I have never ended up well when 100% vegan, but feel really good when 95% or so. I vacillate between being ok with that compromise and not being ok with it. What really got to me about the Jolie/Mercola coverage is the need to tear down the diet – the way I see it, some people thrive on a 100% vegan diet all the time. Some do not, but really benefit from a mostly vegan diet. There’s no need to tear down the vegan diet just because it does not work for an individual, regardless of the reasons of that individual.
What’s Monday without a little controversy?
Funny timing for this, my grandma started laying into me a bit at a family dinner party last night warning me about a lady in her retirement home who’s been on a vegan diet for years and her bones are so weak she’s in a wheel chair. It was a fun debate when I told her the lady had an eating disorder and spent the next few minutes proving that plant-based protein sources do exist. 
I had ups and downs converting to veganism, energy sags, weight fluctuations, etc. while I figured out the amount of protein I need and the right foods to balance in. As you said, there’s an adjustment period with any diet change and because veganism is not mainstream, it’s not easy to meet all your dietary needs just going with the flow on little research.
Gena, can I just say that you have again re-affirmed me. I’m struggling in a way very similar to Tasha, and I appreciate that you suspend judgment and choose empathy over zeal. Clearly, you feel strongly about veganism; but I think it is more important and admirable that you feel strongly about caring for people as well. Many thanks.
Way to put this out there, Gina. I agree with your sentiments 100%.
Fantastic post. Always important to know a situation 360 before getting into everything.
You brought up some terrific points of interest!
Great post, very interesting to read something a little different. I have also wondered how veganism could be the most optimal health solution when it is so difficult to find B-12 in non-animal sources without supplementation. I think that I remember reading that the reason animal products contain B-12 is because the animals are ingesting it through bacteria in the soil, and that humans would ingest B-12 naturally if we were still eating vegetables directly out of the soil without washing them first like early humans did. Since it is so important to wash our produce thoroughly due to the widespread usage of pesticides and other toxic substances in the soil, we no longer have that opportunity (and many people would probably be too weirded-out about just brushing off and eating a carrot anyway.) So, while it may seem “unnatural” to have to supplement with pills or use sources such as algae and nutritional yeast for B-12, it’s only difficult because we are no longer getting B-12 right from the ground itself! Have you heard anything about this? I certainly do not recommend that anyone try to get their B-12 this way, it just helped it to make sense to me that veganism was probably possible without supplements or hard-to-find-in-nature foods at one point in time, just not now.
This is absolutely true Alayna! And I’m glad you mentioned. In a more primitive world, we would be ingesting B-12 through soil.
However, I find all arguments that involve casting a backward glance back to some Edenic time and place to find the “ideal” human diet a bit silly, and I think they’re all ultimately a little doomed. I’m more interested in figuring out what’s the most pragmatic, nourishing, ethical, and enjoyable diet for me to eat right now, in 2010.
From a scientific standpoint, though, that’s a super important point to remember re: B-12!
Not a big fan of Mercola, for sure.
However, when it comes to vegan diets, it’s not just about how “some” people cannot handle them. One needs to consider sex and age also.
I know a couple of women – one vegetarian and one vegan – who started feeling sluggish and ill after 2 (vegetarian) and 3 (vegan) decades on their given diet choices.
In the vegetarian’s case, it was low Iron and B12, which supplementation could not cure (including injections). In the vegan’s case, it was B12 and Vit D (and this woman was the healthiest eater I have ever encountered).
I can easily get miffed when some vegans (and I’m not putting you in that group) go all crazy about it and say such things like “I don’t believe that…” Well, try turning 38 (vegetarian) or 44 (vegan), and then come talk to me. Truth is as time goes on, our bodies don’t necessarily respond the same to the diets we’ve been eating. Long term eating habits can affect your body.
Sure, these diets can be healthy, but one has to be careful to listen to their bodies. It’s not easy for my friend who was vegan for nearly 30 years to start eating fish and eggs.
Thank you, Marcia, for not putting me in that group.
I think there’s great truth to this observation. And women do encounter more difficulty with veganism (that I see) than men do; then again, women are susceptible to more dietary challenges in general than men are (at least that I’ve seen), emotional and nutritional.
It’s also interesting that your friends are now leaving veganism. I have spoken to *so* many women who have actually made the opposite choice in middle age, finding that they can’t eat animal protein anymore. This was even true of one health educator I interviewed myself, who had been an outspoken critic of veganism for decades. She stopped being able to process animal protein after menopause.
Gena
I do agree that this is a factor. For myself, I noticed when I was eating less and less meat that it was also a drop in quality protein for my body and performance started to suffer. I never wanted to turn into one of those bloggers who puts protein powder in every recipe, but when you’re a teenage boy and a runner it turns out that your protein needs can be VERY high. I eat chicken and beef mostly because I prefer that an option over protein powder(although I do eat hemp protein 2-3 times a day) or tofu, which causes digestion problems for me similar to how beans affect me. I’m not saying this is how EVERYBODY in my situation needs to be; obviously Brendan Brazier does an excellent job at performing how he does while eating like he does. He’s also built an empire around that, though, and has turned his eating habits into a brand which gives him a bit of a luxury to prioritize it more, whereas as a student just getting by day by day I can’t focus the same amount of time or money knowing just how much protein I’m getting or how alkaline my body is.
Like most comments, I’ve written and finished this not quite knowing what my point is. But hopefully this gives a point for anyone to jump off of if they’d like to.
Another stellar comment. Some people simply will have this reaction to the change in protein sources, I’m sure. I’m sure that this is also more pronounced among athletes.
It wasn’t an issue for me, but I’ve never eaten what I’d call a high protein diet, ever. And my athletic stamina went way up as a vegan — a combination of how my body responded, and also how I took better care of myself in general when I made that choice.
I would so much rather use protein powder in a smoothie than ever eat fish or eggs
So that’s an easy choice for me. It doesn’t come cheap, I know, but I also take my feelings about environmental and humane cost into account. But I like hearing the perspective of 1) an athlete, 2) a student on a budget, 3) a dude, 4) a smart dude.
As Angelia Jolie gives veganism a thumbs down, Bill Clinton gives it a thumbs up.
http://www.ecorazzi.com/2010/09/17/president-bill-clinton-confirms-hes-experimenting-with-vegan-diet/
Personally, I’d like to have both of them over for dinner and show them what a “real vegan meal” should look like. Maybe with a Choosing Raw recipe or two in my back pocket.
Gena, this reminds me a lot of the post you did on Amanda Seyfried, and how her words will probably deter a lot of her fans from considering raw foods.
Gena,
I’m so glad you responded to this. I was going shoot that article to you, too, I was so disgusted when I read it. Thank you for taking the time. It feels like all around me lately there is an anti-vegan trend going on. Hm. I guess it must be counter-resistance!
Thanks again,
T
Gena – thanks for your insights. I’ve just discovered your web sight. I’m impressed, and I look forward to exploring it further. Believe me, from a medical standpoint, the country needs more clinical nutritionists like you who can look at the big picture and make sense out of nutritional clinical research, then relay that to the public in a clear and concise way.
Thank you Gena and thank you everyone for your insightful comments. I am happy that this is a safe place to express varying viewpoints. Gena- you should be proud; this community is worth celebrating!
Good gracious, I agree. I love my readers SO much.
Curiously, I saw one of the tabloids in the checkout line when shopping this past weekend–with a cover article about Angelina being alarmingly thin again. This presumably on her current, omnivorous diet.
There is no doubt that a carefully planned vegan diet can provide sufficient nutrients and kcalories. Accordingly, I disagree with Jolie’s alleged statement–it’s needlessly hyperbolic and disparaging of veganism. That being said, my brief bout with veganism was not successful. It was too difficult on my college campus and left me feeling drained of energy; also the lack of calcium is a concern for someone with experience of amenorrhea.
Anyway, such extreme statements are in poor taste, as veganism is a choice based on the individual.
Dear Gena~
This is the first time I have ‘stumbled’ upon your website/blog.
I really enjoyed your post and more over your compassionate comments to other readers(true dedication!).
I have been vegetarian for 22 years and vegan for 4. I look forward to browsing your site and reading your future writings. Thank you.
Live juicy!
kc
Great post Gena! I just sent out 2 tweets, because I am finding that so many docs are telling people that their vegan diet is harming them. I was so sick at one point from Crohn’s that my blood level dropped to 3 (normal is 13-15), my protein levels were extremely low and my B12, not because of my diet, but because of lack of absorption and lose of blood from crohn’s. My fam and doc all wanted me to eat a big juicy steak ASAP! And I refused. I stuck to my vegan diet to prove to them and myself that I could come back. And I did. My levels are all normal now with a little supplemental help (I get b12 shots from my doc) and the right foods. I understand people finding veganism isn’t “right” for them, but I just want to put that out there for those struggling. Don’t lose hope!!
Hi Lauren! I’m so happy you listened to what you knew was true for your body rather than relying on that doc’s advice. I recently went through a major health event and my primary physician told me conclusively that there was nothing that could be done nutritionally to assist my condition. Instead she was recommending harmful drugs that would put my body through temporary, early menopause… Ummmmm, no, thank you. In seeking 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th opinions from a range of health practitioners, and doing my own independent research, I found common advice that a diet consisting of no meat, no dairy and no wheat were recommended – yes, the vegan diet. I’m so gratful to have the luxury of being able to survey the advice of many health providers. I’m sad to think of how many people take the advice I was first given. My experience with veganism has shown me that my body does not thrive on a purely vegan diet, but on a primarily vegan diet I feel my best. Occasional consumption of fish keeps me thriving. I learned this over 3 years of paying attention to the information my body gives me in response to diet. I guess what I’m trying to say is that a traditional medical opinion may not offer the best source of nutritional guidance, and certainly not when it contrasts with what you know from the body’s wisdom. We are blessed to live in a country full of opportunity and choices. Blogs like this help us educate ourselves in exercising these privileges in a manner that is best for us as individuals.
I hadn’t heard about Angelina, but I had a similar reaction on reading Lierre Keith’s Vegetarian Myth. Lierre blames the vegan diet she followed for almost 20 years for a whole host of illnesses including a degenerative spine condition. Even though I’m not a vegan (I eat bee products and cultured dairy), I found her arguments deeply flawed. Her diet was clearly inadequate on many fronts (she was following a low fat diet for one), and she never questioned whether a component of her diet (gluten?) was making her sick. I guess what angered me about her book is that even though she herself is a committed environmentalist and an outspoken critic of factory farms, I think her readers will get the “veganism is bad” message and not the rest of it. It’s of course impossible to feed 7 billion people on pastured animal products, so it behooves us to eat a lot less of them, and to find ways to make the vegan diet work, even if it entails “unnatural” help from supplements and a little more planning than a diet including animal fat and protein would require.
I think it’s important to recognize that “veganism” is not a diet. It’s important when we embrace “veganism,” whether for health reasons or ethical reasons, we need to be careful to get the same variety of nutrients we were getting from an omnivorous or vegetarian diet. In most cases, people’s health improves on a vegan diet, because the standard American diet isn’t a very healthy one. But not always. I am not willing, like many raw foodists, to dismiss the whole science of nutrition. Just look at the medicinal properties of herbs, which are generally consumed in small quantities. I think vitamins and minerals are real things and deficiencies are equally real.
And I think thinner people, like Angelina, face the additional challenge of getting that variety of nutrients, because they’re just not eating very much. I know you’re not a big fan of supplements, but you’re also very young and very healthy and you exercise every day, allowing you to eat a bit more every day than I for example can eat. Which is a big reason I do supplement … with vegan protein powder and bee pollen and other things as needed. I’m not a pill popper, but I’m always taking this or that supplement. I do think it’s important to pay attention to iron levels, B12 levels, and to make sure we’re getting adequate protein. When you eat 3000 calories a day, you’re going to take in a lot more nutrients than if you only eat 1500, and it’s possible animal products are more “nutrient dense” and / or more easily assimilated?
Gandhi is a famous example of someone who did not thrive indefinitely on a vegan diet and was brought back to health with raw goats’ milk on a couple of occasions. He used it medicinally. I wonder if that’s not the answer for those want to be vegan but who don’t thrive on the diet? To add in “just enough” dairy or meat or fish to allow our bodies to heal, rebuild, whatever?
As always, a staggeringly rich and intelligent comment, which I could not have said better myself, Elizabeth!
You’re quite right about supplements. Vegans need certain ones for sure (b-12 and D3) and may benefit from certain others depending on activity level, age, health history, etc (responding to Caroline above, I do and always will take calcium because of my past history with osteopenia).
You’re also hitting at one of my major and cherished beliefs, which is that veganism is a choice made not because it’s the “ideal human diet” (as I tried to say in other comments or responses, I find this whole endeavor of chasing after the “world’s perfect diet” to be rather foolish), but because, given the world in which we are living, it feels right to some of us on various fronts. That doesn’t mean we shouldn’t take care, if we do choose to eat this way, to do it wisely, and my main point here was that it’s the nuances of how one eats as a vegan, rather than being vegan vs. non, that’s often at the heart of certain problems that arise. And I’m just so exhausted of the communal glee that greets the newly non-vegan — must people be so tremendously happy to see vegans fail to thrive? Let’s not forget that a whole lot of them do thrive, and in a very longterm fashion.
I’d guess that some people assimilate animal proteins better than plant, and it’s true that iron from animal foods is easier to assimilate. Again, something that is usually easy to work with if you do choose to be a vegan.
I think the idea of using animal foods medicinally is actually pretty brilliant.
G
And I’m just so exhausted of the communal glee that greets the newly non-vegan — must people be so tremendously happy to see vegans fail to thrive? Let’s not forget that a whole lot of them do thrive, and in a very longterm fashion.
That always gets me, too. You can almost hear the hands slapping together, high-fiving. What the heck? Plenty of people fail to thrive on the standard American diet.
Agreed. Half of our country seems not to be thriving on omnivorism, such that it is, except it’s not via deficiency, but via toxicity and excess. My point in the last graf.
But again I say, it’s the WAY they eat, not the fact that they eat animal foods, that is to blame, just as I think it’s *usually* the nuance of veganism, not veganism per se, that is at the heart of failure to thrive situations. Not *always*, as Tasha makes clear.
But back to your point — yes, people love to hold up cases of veganism failing, without looking at the fact that a whole lot of people do badly on many types of lifestyles or diets.
I don’t have a problem with the fact that she stated the diet didn’t work for her.
It’s the way that she said it.
She seems like an intelligent human being, one who is concerned with the well-being of the world,
judging by all the humanitarian work she does.
This is why I was surprised that she’s not more environmentally conscious and aware of the general
benefits of a plant-based diet for people, animals, the world, etc.
She made it out like the vegan diet kills people because it does not have enough nutrition…
This is unfortunate, as she is in a position to influence the mindsets of so many people.
We’re all different and not all diets work for everyone. I’d say eat an organic, whole foods, plant-based diet and monitor bloodwork and do what you need to keep yourself healthy.
Speaking of problems on a vegan diet:
A long term (15 years) raw vegan author Paul Nison recently admitted he’s no longer vegan because it was messing
with his health. This video is worth watching:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFN3wLPoqZw&feature=player_embedded
Thanks for such a thoughtful comment.
I must confess, however, that I’m no great admirer of Nison’s, and didn’t like the extravagant anti-vegan reactionary sentiments that accompanied this video when it came out (not so much his, as commenters’). In fact, I wrote a post that was related to it: http://www.choosingraw.com/a-shift-away-from-veganism-in-the-raw-world/
Thanks for pointing me to that post, it is interesting.
I’m def. not a big fan of Nison’s either.. but his video introduced me to the idea that an all plant-based diet might not work for everyone.
My journey has been different than yours. I was raw before I was vegan. Only now am I starting to embrace all things vegan and am thinking of going 100% vegan.
I think the reason that 100% raw vegans won’t take supplements is because they are not “natural”. They’d rather
drink raw milk or what not than take supplements.
They also perceive raw food as actually poisonous, and choose rather eating something animal than something cooked.
Nison recommends goat milk. Tonya Zboya recommends drinking 1 raw egg per month. Victoria Boutenko says she eats the bugs that come in her greens. etc.
Thanks, Dorota. I do respect that, though of course I’m not persuaded by the food as poison argument. In any case, I hope that my blog is a place where you feel comfortable seeing a new perspective!
Hahah, I don’t subscribe to that argument at all myself either – in fact I feel a lot better on a high raw as opposed to an all raw diet.
I was just offering what I believe some of the reasons are for the current raw movement shifting away from veganism.
Are you kidding, I love your blog! I’m addicted to it right now. Thanks for making an amazing contribution with all of your in-depth, thoughtful and amazing articles.
But, generally speaking, yes, I would feel totally comfortable seeing/discussing new perspectives here.
I agree with your thoughtful statements here wholeheartedly. To put it more bluntly and in my own words, anytime I hear someone saying veganism nearly killed them or made them weak or something of the sort, I say to myself that it wasn’t the veganism that did it, it was their failure to get proper nutrition as a vegan. When you see an athlete like Brendan Brazier or Scott Jurek, you just know there is no merit to blanket statements condemning veganism. If one is eating the proper foods to get their nutrients and taking the right supplements, veganism is not only adequate, but very healthy.
Hi Gena! I’m a huge fan of your blog and I have a question for you — I’m experimenting with veganism, looking to make a very gradual transition over time as I learn more about proper nutrition and adapt to vegan food, but many people have told me that you gain weight on a vegan diet because you need to eat more food to get the same benefits and nutrients as you would on a meat and dairy diet. Is this true? What’s your take on this?
Hey Jenny!
This doesn’t have to be true at all, actually. Many sources of vegan protein and fat (nuts and tempeh, for example), are about as calorically dense as omni foods, so if you are sure to eat them reasonably, you won’t have to load up on volume. If you’re asking whether, calorie for calorie, vegan proteins are inherently inferior, thus you need to double up, I’m not a believer. I think that the proteins, especially if they’re not complete proteins (like soy, for example) can be slightly less easy to assimilate, but I think that the gap has been overstated.
I think iron is a toughie, but it’s not impossible, again. A tablespoon of blackstrap molasses daily actually saved me from anemia in college (PRE vegan, I might add), and that’s hardly a huge volume of food! So I’d say that, if you’re eating wisely, you can avoid too much volume.
Though volume is a nice added benefit
Gena
Gena,
Have you ever personally met anyone who gained weight as a vegan? I have met lots of people who have lost excess weight to get to healthy weight as vegans. But when it comes to gaining weight, I know lots of heavier vegetarians. I think this is because they are loading up on carbs and dairy. But this is just my guess. But can vegans be carbetarians?
I know vegans of every size and shape (I know people who eat every diet and are all sizes and shapes — vegans get scrutinized for their weight because we make special choices). So yeah, of course you can eat all carbs or all sugar or all low quality foods as a vegan and gain weight. You can also do that as an onmi, and tons do!
I don’t have anything to add to the comments on the article above (I LOVE the input here!!) but I wanted to say that I gained weight since going vegan, and not because I’m inhaling baked goods at every chance I get. I’m actually kind of stuck at the number I’m at now, a good 25 pounds and two years later.
I don’t eat a lot of fat, and my meals are full of veggies, grains, legumes and a little tofu. I think that I eat more now than when I was a vegetarian, when I lost 80 pounds over 4 years.
I don’t know if that helps, but I wanted to throw in my experience and two cents. You can gain weight, and not by eating vegan cookies all day every day.
Angelina and also Dr Mercola made the same statement just recently. Angelina you and Dr. Mercola need to get real you were on the right diet as we are by nature frugivorous (raw fruit and vegetables)animals. But because we choose to eat meat does not make it the right thing to do.
I have seen a horse eat baby chicks on our farm when I was a kid. And probably if you put a feed bag of baby chicks under the horses nose every day it would eat them too. But it would not be long before the horse was fat and bloated with depression, indigestion, headache’s, autoimmune diseases and arthritis
stumbling around the farm passing gas everywhere it went like Angelina, Dr. Mercola and 95% of the American public. The horse would live only half of its life time and die of cancer or a massive coronary somewhere out on the pasture.
The American public needs to hear the truth like the FDA, USDA and HHS be telling them if they weren’t in the pockets of big agriculture the food business, pharmaceutical companies and the AMA. But they make nothing but profit off of feeding us garbage and toxic medications while we get sicker and sicker from doing just what my horse might have done.
The public needs to stop accepting the feedbag full of indigestible nutritional and mental crap they are handed because they are considered suckers by those in the government, the AMA and big business. Get real Angelina and Mercola and take charge of your life or they will.
Paul
I heard about Angelina Jolie’s “statement” a few days ago, and I was somewhat shocked.
It seemed so strange to me that someone with all the money in the world could not afford to see a nutritionist of some sort about her diet
I agree with you completely when you said, “There are healthy omnivore diets and healthy vegan diets,” and I would think that if she were motivated to try a vegan diet, shouldn’t she be motivated to do it correctly?
Thanks for this as usual thoughtfully written post. I started trying to read Mercola’s response to this story but found it so haphazard, inconsistent and based on wholly egotistical conjecture that I could not continue. I think that there are risks attached to any diet if it is unbalanced and centreing too strongly on certain food groups (I really struggle with the idea of fruitarianism as a healthy, long term option). Whenever people start on the “Doesn’t veganism make you weak and unhealthy?” tack, I ask them if they are aware that Carl Lewis won 9 olympic gold medals on a vegan diet, and that he saw a real improvement in his training times once he became vegan. I also gather that Martina Navratilova was a vegan while winning all her Wimbledon titles.. That usually gives them pause for thought..
it seems as though angie’s life is hectic and she seems like she doesn’t have that much time for herself, hence, not enough time to eat. so its apparent the vegan diet doesn’t fit her lifestyle unless she can do her research and make sure she gets all the nutrition and protein that she needs, vegan-ly.
Irritable, are we?? Hmmmmm….Jolie speaks of her experience. What’s wrong with that? You speak of your, I speak of mine and your readers speak of theirs..
Hbut the tone against someone coming out and saying “veganism isn’t for me” is outstandingly apparent.
Vegetarianism of the 60′s, veganism thereafter, and raw foodism in the nearby passed, all didn’t work for me. I, too, thought if done RIGHT it could work. I did it right and it didn’t work.
I’m still an environmentalist. I lived on a farm, I learned about sustainable farming, I buy organic and my household cleaning supplies are homemade and harmless.
I, too, care. This stance of “us [pure and holy] and them [needing a cleans and dumb] probably should end so we can unite in common denominators: health for the planet, health for the individual etc..ect…add your own.
A friend of mine from France said to me, while visiting, “Your vegans are so angry, what is wrong with them?” I had to shrug my shoulders and say “I’m not certain, I can only guess…they point the finger a lot, and grumble, eh?!”
I lost over 60 pounds. I was over-fed and undernourished. I was always hungry and never experienced satiety. I was depressed and irritable.
Three years later, no longer. Now I’m just working on getting my memory back to normal.
All the best to you,
Karen in CA
ps. Mercola doesn’t speak for me although I think he has honorable intentions on the whole. As far as product sales, don’t you get a kickback when you put remmendations out there and links? Same thing, no? We all have our favorite items and want to share about them.
Was that actually a question? I wasn’t feeling irritable when I wrote this, no. But I appreciate your asking me.
I think my post made very clear that I wasn’t seeking to denigrate or put down anyone who finds that veganism doesn’t work for his or her body. As you may have seen above, one readers expressed concerns to this effect in the comments, and I actually encouraged her to do what’s best — even if that means not being vegan. I’m not evangelical or preachy in my veganism, and I don’t think any other vegans ought to be.
My point was that a) it’s hard to say why a vegan diet does or doesn’t work for some, but I want to remind readers that it’s often how one is eating as a vegan, not veganism itself, that’s a problem. Clearly, as an eco-conscious and health minded woman, you must have eaten very well, and it didn’t work. Fine! I respect that. But many do seem to approach veganism without an informed perspective, and that’s what accounts for the problems. Is it not fair of me to point that out?
I also wanted to say that it’s unfair of those who have tried and left the vegan fold to constantly applaud when others give it up — and I’m sorry, but many do. Veganism is not for all bodies, but many of us found our best health with it, and we’re no more deserving of stereotyping (“vegans are all so angry”) or discouragement than omnivores are.
I don’t make money when I review a product, ever. I get the product samples, and that’s it. If someone buys the product after I write about it, I never see a dollar, and you’ll notice that I don’t have specific product ads on my site. I do have Foodbuzz advertising, which readers can ignore if they like, as it’s nestled quietly to the right of my text.
This blog is a welcoming and encouraging forum. As many commenters above have noted, it’s a place where readers feel “safe” expressing varied and diverse views on food and body. It’s one of the things I take most pride in. To miss that is really to miss a lot about this blog, and though very little mockery is present in these comments (with some exceptions), yours is one of the few that came close.
Best,
Gena
great post and the comments are fab as always! not to beat the dead horse here but she almost died most certainly from not eating enough period! it has nothing to do with veganism or not. plenty of people that eat meat are anemic myself included!
Love this post. Gena, you are so well-written and brought up some great points!
this was my official response when the story first broke in late august:
It is much easier to eat healthy on a vegan diet than an omnivorous one which is loaded with saturated fat and linked to diseases like cancer and debilitating conditions like asthma and Alzheimer’s. Angelina clearly went about it wrong and considering how much money she has, why didn’t she hire a chef or nutritionist to inform her first? or ask her partner who walks around hollywood with one of the sexiest, healthiest bodies on a strict vegetarian diet?
I’m also inclined to think this is a lie since for years she’s said things like “I enjoy rats” remarking about how she lived on them while living in third world countries.
In any event, all diets need to be balanced – you need to eat a combination of fruits, vegetables, grains and legumes to be healthy. Eating what the earth has created for you is healthy, far more healthy than animal products full of hormones, cholesterol and fat.
and eating meat, particularly red meat as a so-called “humanitarian” is laughable. The single best thing you can do for humanity is to go vegan — the grain that goes to feed cattle could instead feed those starving people she is trying to bring awareness to. An acre of land can produce 20,000 lbs of potatoes or a measly 165 lbs of meat! If all the world went veg, there would be no world hunger. Think about that, Angie.
Sounds to me like Angelina is to blame a vegan diet for her overriding selfish desire to eat animals and I’m not buying it
There would be some of us still hungry. We aren’t all blessed with a robust colon than can handle large volumes of greens, beans, and nuts. I for one am intolerant to many “healthy” foods. I am also intolerant to eggs, dairy, gluten, and chicken.
Until you wrestle with autoimmune disease, you really don’t understand.
For many, it is easier to be healthy on a vegan diet than on a standard American diet. For those of us who cannot be vegan due to medical issues (and this is a real phenomenon, not a clear-cut case of “doing it wrong”) but would truly love to be and believe in the ethical ideology, this sort of comment is extremely black and white, and frankly, regardless of who it is directed at, a little hurtful. It isn’t easy and it’s a very difficult situation to be in. It’s unfortunate that anything Angelina says is broadcasted at such loud volume, but there’s no evidence to back up your assertion that she “clearly went about it wrong” or is “overriding[ly] selfish,” only your generalization.
Wow, I’m thrilled that the e-mail inspired a post that received such an astounding amount of feedback. You have some very articulate readers, Gena (which is a reflection of your writing as well)! I keep thinking that some people don’t have time or patience enough to do the research to help them feel better and find balance when shifting to the vegan lifestyle, which is why a nutritionist like YOU is so helpful! Having someone coach you through the rough parts can make a huge difference in the ease of the transition…there’s so much information out there (often conflicting info at that), so it’s sometimes good to have someone to offer advice through the journey. Thanks again, Gena, for sharing all your wisdom and grace with us!
Just BTW you don’t need D3 supplements. One can get vitamin D from D2 which is plant-based. Ideally of course we could just get out vitamin D naturally from the sunshine. Dr Michael Hollick who is a world expert in vitamin D has done many studies using D2 as opposed to D3 and he suggests that they are a suitable alternative to D3. Dr Mercola pushes D3 and does rant about it a lot but of course he does SELL them and why wouldn’t he push the products he sells
. He is full of sh*t sometimes. Thanks for your site.
You are VERY welcome
As a new vegan (so new that I haven’t even referred to myself as that outloud until now) I felt a bit discouraged reading through the comments and hearing about so many people that had to go back to eating meat and/or animal products. Even though I’ve only eaten vegan exclusively for about 3 weeks (I’ve been vegetarian for a year), I’ve never felt better and have been really enjoying my new way of eating. I’m sure I’m in some sort of honeymoon phase, but at this point I see this as a forever thing. I’m sure that those that commented above did as well, and it seems like they did everything to keep eating a vegan diet. That kind of kicked me out of my I heart being vegan feeling. However, I re-read your post and felt re-inspired. I definitely shouldn’t feel defeated before the journey has really even begun. Thanks for your great post as always!
Jen O, don’t give up. It is sooo worth it. I have been vegan for about 14 years am am really happy with it and may I add very healthy (I am a naturopath/nutritionist too, which helps on the information side).
May I direct you to an excellent podcast by Colleen Patrick-Goudreau called “Vegetarian Food for Thought”. She also has a website. I have no pecuniary interests here
. I just find her inspiring and full of excellent information. Best wishes.
Thank you so much for sharing! It seemed like there were so many people banding together saying, “Hey, veganism didn’t work for me either!” and I kept waiting for others to reply that they have been vegan for years and thriving. Even after I went to bed after I commented I was thinking about all the bloggers, authors, and even other public figures/celebrities that are thriving on a veagn diet. Gena and others are a great expample of that and I guess it’s just easier to listen to the negative than to remember the positive.
Thank you again!
Jen, I have to second Madeleine’s comments. Let’s not forget that a great many of us are here because we found our way to great health via a vegan diet. That’s certainly my story: I failed to thrive on an omnivorous diet (and of course, that had a lot to do with *how* I ate it, not the fact that it was omnivorous), and veganism changed my life. For the record, it’s been more than a few years, and my bloodwork is consistently stellar, I don’t get sick with any frequency, I’m more active and energetic, and I have more color. I’m also no longer anemic, which I was through the better part of my teenage years. My body weight is normal and stable.
Is my story everyone’s story? Of course not. That’s what these stories are showing us, right? But I wouldn’t let the cases of veganism not working out deter you from sticking with it, as it does work out spectacularly for a great many men and women. And isn’t it true that more conventional diets don’t work out for a great many men and women?
Thank you so much for reminding me of this. You are right and your reply means a lot to me. I realize this is the point of your blog post and it really was the comments making me feel disheartened. I am determined to show by example that veganism is what is best for me.
Well, it’s important not to talk about veganism as though it’s some sort of perverse test of strength. If you don’t feel well, that means you either have to change things up and eat a little differently, or you need to think about how right it is for you.
But I also think that, if you feel good, then you feel good! So many new vegans start out with this secretive fear that it’s only a matter of time before something goes wrong, and there’s no reason to feel that way. If you’re feeling great and eating well, then you’ve clearly figured out what works. And you should be proud of yourself and continue onwards.
I know I’m late to this discussion, but anytime I hear stories like this I wonder why we aren’t talking about other diets that “almost kill” people. Many members of my own family have diabetes, high blood pressure, and heart problems. Some have even suffered heart attacks.
Such a small percentage of the population is vegan, and yet every time someone finds a fault in this diet it seems to make headlines. Perhaps it’s easy to point fingers without realizing that there are many diets that have the potential to be harmful to health.
I have really enjoyed these discussions…It got me thinking about my own brief stray from veganism. I wanted to share a small part of my story. I was a raw vegan for a year, 80/10/10 raw vegan for 6 months. My skin was horrendous. Consistenly getting worse and worse (due to lack of protein and hormone imbalance from so much sugar) I followed advice from a book by Dr Perricone to begin eating greek yogurt, eggs, and lots of fish to clear up my skin. (I gave it a month trial) Good news, I did indeed have beautiful, clear skin after 80/10/10 disaster. But I also gained 6 lbs in the process. Being a more petite 5’1 woman, yikes! (I always weighed in at a healthy, average weight for someone my size) I was indeed happy my skin was clear but unhappy that animal products could make me gain weight like that – in one month.
I have since gone back to a vegan lifestyle, and so happy I have too. I actually felt horrible eating animal products again. This was my first time eating animal products in a year and I listened to how my body reacted very closely so I could decide if it was best for my body to continue eating them. The yogurt made my throat hurt – almost like I was about to get sick. Every night I thought I was coming down with strep throat. What an odd feeling. I also no longer felt that ‘clean’ feeling as vegans do. My stomach was always achey, and bloated. My daily bm’s were COMPLETELY thrown off of schedule. I bought one carton of eggs from my local farmer, I did not notice a huge difference eating them. I felt more tired as well. Its taking me a while to recover from that brief period, honestly! My body still feels ‘off’ and I’ve been back to vegan eating for over a month now. My skin has stayed pretty clear! Yay! Now my diet revolves around whole grains, specifically brown rice and quinoa, beans, vegetables (GREENS!!!) and of course yummy fruits. Protein and healthy fats are very important, I could see how badly I needed it and was not getting it. Maybe this was why Angelina Jolie had a bad experience. But I have to agree with a previous commenter, you would think she could afford an amazing nutritionist who could help her with a vegan menu that supplied all her nutritional needs?
Anyways, I just wanted to pass on my own personal experience incorporating animal products back into my diet. Its a thumbs down for me.
I have been vegetarian for 14 years and vegan for the past 3. Every year my doctor tests my iron and B vitamin levels and they are always fine. When I was lacto-ovo vegetarian I developed osteoporosis — after I went vegan, I decided that if my next bone scan showed my bones were worse, I would start consuming dairy products again. I am happy to say that at my last bone scan, for the first time in probably a decade my bones were finally normal!!! All while being on a vegan diet
Just like you said, I think really the issue is one’s overall nutritional intake rather than whether you are consuming animal proteins or not.
A friend of mine has been on a vegan diet for awhile. She was worried it was making her sicker than before (she has chronic health issues)–even though she takes supplements– and she just wanted some more variety in her diet.
She tried eating meat a few times and felt much sicker. Obviously she didn’t have a deficiency of animal products at all. She’s off them and trying to get to the root of it versus blaming on veganism.
Well thank you for this elegant and lovely response, Lauren!
I’m also a student of the sciences, and I could not agree more that the human body is deeply mysterious, and that our current understanding only can account for so much. But remember that I work in the field of alternative nutrition, wherein one is constantly subjected to mystical and vague claims — which is why I try as often as I can to insist that people speak with specificity about their experiences. Are there limits? Yes. It’s humbling to be able to acknowledge the things we’ll never fully understand about our own bodies, and in my own experiences I’ve had to bow to unknowables more than a few times.
I think the main point here is that eating animal foods is best for you, period! And you certainly seem to have given Tasha some hope (right, T?), so as her friend I am personally grateful for that. Thanks for your contributions to my blog.
G
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